Talk:James Hepburn, 4th Earl of Bothwell

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Duke or Earl?

Hepburn is far better known as the Earl of Bothwell, rather than the Duke of Orkney. Wouldn't it make more sense to make this the title used in the article name? Big Jim Fae Scotland (March 5 2004)

It would, but Duke is higher than Earl.

Reworked

I have sorted out this article. It is much better and more accurate now. David Lauder 20:28, 19 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ancestor to both Audrey and Katharine Hepburn?

It seems he is, and then the relation would fit this page. 85.227.226.243 (talk) 13:40, 19 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

"It seems" highly unlikely that such a claim could be verified or, indeed, that it should have a place in this biography. The Duke only had one child, William, who was illegitimate. Not even the mother's name is known. Little is know about William. It would be a genealogical sensation for him to be 'discovered' today. Regards, David Lauder (talk) 13:55, 19 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It has been disputed that William Hepburn was his child (by the descendents of Bothwell's sister, no less) because in no contemporary document is he ever referred to as such. William Hepburn was in fact Bothwell's cousin. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.88.72.116 (talk) 09:05, 26 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

New research

This is quite interesting with new evidence about his relationship with Mary S. Malick78 (talk) 15:57, 7 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
- In keeping with this, would it not suggest that the sentence "Mary was taken prisoner by Bothwell and violently raped by him to secure marriage to her and the crown." be modified to "allegedly"? Or something of that nature? Especially with as specific an adverb as "violently," it seems somewhat POV —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.111.198.119 (talk) 06:44, 6 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Clarification

In 2.Feuds, what does "no her waas notas" mean, is this a typing error, I have no idea!Lilaac (talk) 16:43, 1 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Marriage to Queen Mary I

He wasn't married to Mary I, Mary I (Mary Tudor) was married to Philip of Spain. 86.177.199.242 (talk) 15:29, 22 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

His wife was Mary I of Scotland (better known as Mary, Queen of Scots). Philip II of Spain's wife was Mary I of England. Surtsicna (talk) 17:01, 22 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Now I understand, thank you. 109.150.122.90 (talk) 19:21, 27 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Mary's ride

We need to tidy this section up:

"In the following summer, upon hearing that he had been seriously wounded and was likely to die, she rode all the way through the hills and forests of the Borders to be with him at Hermitage Castle only a few weeks after giving birth to her son. However, historian Lady Antonia Fraser asserts that Queen Mary was already on her way to visit Bothwell on matters of state before she heard about his illness, and that therefore this visit is not evidence they were already lovers at the time of his accident. Author Alison Weir agrees, and in fact the records show that Mary waited a full six days after learning of his injuries before going to visit Bothwell. The story of her mad flight to his side was put about later by her enemies to discredit her."

We need to resolve whether this is true or not and if not, write it differently, as it stands it just what you get when lots of people write an encyclopedia! I suggest the following text or something like it:

- The story was put about that Mary rode all the way through the borders to see Bothwell when he was thought likely to die, however @ and @ assert that this was put about... later by her enemies.

IceDragon64 (talk) 21:21, 30 October 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Death

is repeated. The section needs cleanup. — $Llywelyn II$ 19:10, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Sources for future article expansion

These "sources" were listed

Les Affaires du Conte du Boduel, l'An 1568, Bannatyne Club, Edinburgh, (1829) autobiography of the events of 1568 (in French) and letters concerning captivity in Denmark (in Latin)
The Royal Families of England Scotland and Wales, with their descendants, etc., by John and John Bernard Burke, London, 1848, volume 2, pedigree XII.
Scottish Kings, a Revised Chronology of Scottish History, 1005–1625, by Sir Archibald H. Dunbar, Bart., Edinburgh, 1899, p. 256.
Lord Bothwell, Robert Gore Browne, Collins (1937)
Acta Curiae Admirallatus Scotiae, 1557–1562, ed Thomas Callander Wade, Stair Society (1937) (Bothwell's Admiralty Court records.)
Lines of Succession, by Jiri Louda & Michael Maclagan, London, 1981.
Mary Queen of Scots, by Antonia Fraser, 13th reprint, London, 1989, ISBN 0-297-17773-7.

but entirely unused. Kindly restore them to the article as they are cited to verify statements in the text. More info at the EB cites given and, now that things have been edited, there should be inline citations to the EB material. — $Llywelyn II$ 19:18, 8 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

2nd 1/2 of 1st paragraph needs re-writing

The second to last sentence of the intro paragraph is confusing and a run-on sentence. It has some disjointed information and maybe extraneous info. Unfortunately i am not 100% confident on how to correct it, so hopefully someone else is General dissaray (talk) 06:43, 24 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

This is the sentence that needs fixing: “His marriage to Mary was controversial and divided the country; when he fled the growing rebellion to Scandinavia to Norway to try to restart a relationship with a woman called Anna Thorensen, from Hardanger he was arrested because of breach of promise to her before he married Mary, she had a home in the North of England and was friends with Mary, she returned to Norway after he smote her.” General dissaray (talk) 06:45, 24 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I removed the edit from January 31 for the reasons cited above.

Óli Gneisti (talk) 18:13, 15 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Updated link

The article with new research posted in Talk by Malick78 is gone.

Just popping in to post an archived link: https://web.archive.org/web/20081014002947/http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article3695007.ece

Scottish Consort?

I note that: -

1. List_of_Scottish_royal_consorts#House_of_Stuart_(1542–1649) includes the subject of this article.

2. Henry Stuart, Lord Darnley has a succession box saying that the next person after him to hold the title of 'King consort of Scots' was the subject of this article.

3. Anne of Denmark has a succession box saying that the last person before her to be 'consort of Scotland' was Lord Darnley.

4. Template:Scottish_consort includes the subject of this article.

5. The subject of this article is a member of Category:Scottish_royal_consorts.

6. This article has an infobox describing its subject as 'Royal consort of Scotland'.

7. The succession boxes in this article do not include this title.

I suggest that Wikipedia should be internally consistent. It looks as if Anne of Denmark's article and the lack of a succession box in this article are the odd ones out. Should they be brought into line with the rest? Does anyone know what the reliable sources say? Alekksandr (talk) 21:06, 25 April 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Death pillar

There is no citation for claiming he was chained to a pillar which can still be seen today. I can find no evidence of this, other than roundabout rumors. There aren't even any pictures readily available of this supposed pillar, which makes it even less likely considering the popularity of the site today as a haunted castle. 67.21.186.253 (talk) 18:32, 23 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]